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Post by Napoleoff (INTP) on Aug 26, 2018 22:56:20 GMT
Given the abysmal intellectual and spiritual state, caused to a great extent by poor intellectual and spiritual formation stemming in very large part from metaphysical disorientation (by turns deliberately-induced and accidentally-stumbled-into), of most people today I am strongly of the view that at this point the praxis of any organization should be aimed at rectifying as far as possible the general poverty of understanding and pathetic spiritual submissiveness which prevails among our people.
Confucius he say: “The beginning of wisdom is to call things by their proper name.” From the Wade-Giles transcription of Confucius, Book 13, Chapter 3: “If names be not correct, language is not in accordance with the truth of things. If language be not in accordance with the truth of things, affairs cannot be conducted successfully.”
Another adage, attributed variously to Plato and the Hopi Indians, is “Those who tell the stories rule the world” (sometimes given in Plato’s case as “Those who tell the stories rule society.”)
The point of this pompous preamble is that epistemological/ontological confusion and a failure to prevent malefactors from gaining control of the world-narrative have resulted in what appears from our current vantage point to be unprecedented chaos in the minds of our people which has then spilled-over into frightening full-spectrum havoc in the material realm as well. Therefore, a dedicated effort must be made to get people to once again ‘call things by their proper name’ and to bring out an accurate narrative description of the world which serves to clarify our people’s understanding of what is going on instead of making it obscure to them. After they are armed with this understanding, it should be easier for them to (a) understand what truly serves their interests and (b) work out what actions they need to take towards the goal of furthering those interests. Essentially, we need to educate people, as many as possible, imposing our epistemology/ontology and our explanations (stories/narratives) onto a cultural, intellectual and spiritual landscape that sorely needs these things.
I contend that the structure of the organization should, considering what I have written above, be the one that can best serve the goal of enlightening and educating our people, providing an escape route from the mental prison assiduously constructed for them over the last few decades/centuries. Esoteric knowledge certainly has its place, but ultimately a well-constructed and truth-based exoteric narrative has got to be fashioned which can then be driven home through education, dialogue, conversation, repetition on as large a scale as possible and for a sustained time. This all amounts to is the need for organization structured around education, academic work, propaganda, storytelling, discussion and dialogue and everything else necessary to communicate to the masses whatever will steer them in a direction that is more in harmony with our vision of the world and steer them away from the maladaptive BS.
Having not given the subject of organizational structure any thought before this week, I am unable at this point to offer a detailed system of my own, but I will make some suggestions and I hope that in articulating what I think should be the telos (at least for the immediate-term and for the foreseeable future) and praxis of the organization I can provide a suggestive context for further ideas about HOW to structure an organization i.e. the way to work towards the goals I have laid out above. There have been many great ideas for organizational structure proposed in the past week by other members of the forum which could be effectively synthesised with the ideas I lay out here.
I will say that I am inclined towards the idea that we will have to do a deeper and meta-level investigation of organizational structures and that perhaps the method we will use to achieve our telos of educating people has not yet been properly articulated. Perhaps the unified theory of organization aarvoll speculated about is something that can really be created in the long-term.
One thought I have had about the organization is that it should be constantly moving forward and filling new niches and creating new avenues for its activity, A-B testing and using trial and error. It should be capable of expanding into and providing contextualized education about as many areas of life as possible and its areas of interest should always be increasing in number so there is something for everyone. Diversity of method in this case is a good thing, but it should be directed by and always defer to its telos. And I still think it should be hierarchical and right-wing. A tectonic change needs to take place in people’s minds and liberal thought as we know it today must be completely phased out over time.
The International Baccalaureate is one example of an international educational organization, in this case one whose aims we would disagree with, that we could certainly consider taking some cues from in terms of its structure and modus operandi:
However what I envision is even wider and larger than the International Baccalaureate, and would include things like culture, art, media and propaganda as well as basic education (mathematics, science, languages etc.) provided through a lens which will spiritually and intellectually strengthen people instead of undermining them, confusing them and setting them up to be preyed upon.
Anyway, let me know what you think or if you have anything to add.
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Post by slotahimself (INTP) on Aug 26, 2018 23:57:13 GMT
That Confucius quote is in accordance with what I've been thinking about lately in regards to what we're trying to do now. Fundamentally I think what we're going to realize soon, if we don't already, is how important the linguistic properties to the current landscape are and how they've been morphing in a consistent pattern to be against our ability to have any interests or power projection. One I was just thinking about a few minutes before I saw your post was how the politically correct identifier for somebody who is non white has become person of color. With consideration that "colored people" was typically associated with blacks in an American-centric view point, but put that in conjunction with the added pressure lately to get all people other than Europeans to address themselves as a person of color either in combination with their specified ethnicity or instead of it. In a global context, that essentially gets the entire Earth to categorize their interests in a diametrically opposed posturing to Europeans who are directly targeted by it. That to me is a massive yet subtle change to the landscape considering it's just creating a wider funnel that we're obviously excluded from, as opposed to the natural fragmentation you would get from being an Asian-American, African-American, etc.
I find it no coincidence that in the Bible, one of the first things God had Adam do was to name all of the animals. Categorization and differentiation relating to identity being changed with what seems like almost no effort or concern over the last 15 years is still shocking to me. It might prove useful for us to maybe find literature regarding this topic if we can. Words are not things, but stand in for things. That means if words favorable to us have been displaced or have lost positive power that there's a vacuum of representation for our well being.
In regards to the rest of your post I think your suggestions would augment some of the other proposals well, even though it's not a full organizational structure in itself.
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Post by Napoleoff (INTP) on Aug 27, 2018 11:02:56 GMT
What you have referred to, linguistic properties morphing against us, has been consciously engineered this way. Referring to the disruptive behavior of SJW university students, Jordan Peterson in a discussion with Mark Steyn said, "I think this transgressive behavior that you're describing is part of the all-out assault on Western categories of thought, and I think that that was started not even so much by the Marxists as by the French intellectuals in the late 1960s, especially Jacques Derrida who maybe is the most dangerous person of the last 40 years and he is of course the hero of the humanities and much of the social sciences and he believes that, and states this in his work, that the whole purpose of categorization is for exclusion. And categorization is the basis of cognition. And so he basically has made the claim that thought itself is an agent of oppression. And that's absurd except that he's the dominant thinker. And I know people don't understand how radical how radical and transgressive the universities actually are and how deeply-embedded this sort of thinking is in them." www.youtube.com/watch?v=kTUbEUArRzMThe situation at present with regard to classification, differentiation and naming of things is indeed alarming and I share your shock at the rapidity and ease of the changes that have taken place in recent years. It's like everyone else is the casino, operating with their slight edge, and we are the idiot gamblers at the casino; over many cycles the house always wins. In the same way, if we keep operating within our opponent's linguistic and narrative programming (which is opportunistic, unprincipled and ever-shifting so impossible to grasp) then our chance of success is mathematically zero in the long term. I think this article is worth reading, about 'tolerance.' The embedded video in the article is dead, but I think this is the video A.A. refers to in the article: www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ZxLxg-IMO4dailystormer.name/tolerance-is-a-brutal-talmudic-math-equation-and-there-is-only-one-defense/There is if you think about it no reason to consider tolerance a virtue in itself, but here we are in current year and tolerance is the touchstone for how many of our people conduct themselves in the world, especially towards predatory outgroups. The widespread acceptance of homosexuality has now morphed into what is essentially worship of what was traditionally acknowledged as maladaptive and harmful. The academic work of the organization should include deconstructing concepts such as tolerance and racism that public interracial relations are now based, and supplanting them with more accurate, more beneficial and more wholesome concepts, understandings and narratives. We must pay no tribute to the rules created by our opponents apart from to do the opposite of what they would like us to do. I think Ryan Faulk is an example to follow in this respect because does a great job in terms of flipping the script. The Dead End of the MLK Myth: www.youtube.com/watch?v=9cls-nGTjoEI love how in the above video Faulk doesn't merely show how MLK was in the wrong, but is able to paint him as a complete psycho.
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Post by aarvoll (INTJ) on Aug 27, 2018 22:05:30 GMT
Given the abysmal intellectual and spiritual state, caused to a great extent by poor intellectual and spiritual formation stemming in very large part from metaphysical disorientation (by turns deliberately-induced and accidentally-stumbled-into), of most people today I am strongly of the view that at this point the praxis of any organization should be aimed at rectifying as far as possible the general poverty of understanding and pathetic spiritual submissiveness which prevails among our people.
You mentioned to slota that you were also shocked at how effortlessly this uprooting of traditional concepts has been carried out, and this is just one in a long series of data points that leads me to suspect a very deep rooted, ancient conspiracy at work behind the globalist power structures. Bringing language and education back into accord with our interests should be conjoined with a thorough account of how they were corrupted in the first place. On the critical side would involve study of conspiratorial history (of the well sourced scholarly variety) and study of globalist and postmodern texts. On the positive side we may want to look into philology and etymology as key areas to speciate into. It would be a large responsibility, but seeing how critical Latin is to understanding the grounding of our language we might want to consider some group study of the language. If a sufficient number of us (the most dedicated) gained fluency in Latin and conducted some of the higher level discourse in it, that would also provide a very natural barrier between the deep initiates and exoteric members.
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Post by Napoleoff (INTP) on Aug 28, 2018 0:16:58 GMT
Given the abysmal intellectual and spiritual state, caused to a great extent by poor intellectual and spiritual formation stemming in very large part from metaphysical disorientation (by turns deliberately-induced and accidentally-stumbled-into), of most people today I am strongly of the view that at this point the praxis of any organization should be aimed at rectifying as far as possible the general poverty of understanding and pathetic spiritual submissiveness which prevails among our people.
You mentioned to slota that you were also shocked at how effortlessly this uprooting of traditional concepts has been carried out, and this is just one in a long series of data points that leads me to suspect a very deep rooted, ancient conspiracy at work behind the globalist power structures. Bringing language and education back into accord with our interests should be conjoined with a thorough account of how they were corrupted in the first place. On the critical side would involve study of conspiratorial history (of the well sourced scholarly variety) and study of globalist and postmodern texts. On the positive side we may want to look into philology and etymology as key areas to speciate into. It would be a large responsibility, but seeing how critical Latin is to understanding the grounding of our language we might want to consider some group study of the language. If a sufficient number of us (the most dedicated) gained fluency in Latin and conducted some of the higher level discourse in it, that would also provide a very natural barrier between the deep initiates and exoteric members. You make some very good suggestions here about the avenues we could be taking and I agree that it would be advantageous if at all possible to uncover at least something of the outline of any conspiracy in this matter, however ancient or recently-hatched. My own instinct is that if there is a conspiracy behind the phenomena we see detonating today then it is probably between 200-300 years old and no more than 500-600, although the tricks behind it may be (and probably are) based on much older esoteric knowledge that may go back thousands of years. When I say esoteric I account for the possibility that any documentation pertaining to it is not accessible to normal people (which includes us). Who knows what they have stored in the purportedly-labyrinthine Vatican libraries for example? Why is there an obelisk in St Peter's Square? Is it possible that secret societies keep secret histories in their libraries which we cannot currently access? How do you truly access what is going on with the Talmud/Zohar/Kabbalah without being steeped in it from a young age and being a Jew yourself? That said, there exists a wealth of well-sourced scholarly texts involving conspiratorial history and as you said globalist and postmodern texts in the public domain; our advantage now is that with increasing acceptance of globalism on the part of the populace, a huge amount of documentation is pretty much out in the open now and they don't seem to care who reads it. An interesting one to look at is the World Federalist Movement which many very famous (infamous? MLK was one...) so-called "luminaries" of the 20th Century were members of.
Whatever we can piece together should be as accurate and complete as we can humanly make it and only then would it be fit for inclusion into the narrative I proposed we should create for our people.
I am fully in agreement with you and I think that that telling the story of how education and language were corrupted in the first place is indispensable to creating an appreciation for why truth and ontological integrity are important and an understanding of the horrors that can ensue if we deviate from the truth or allow ourselves to be led away from it. Some people in our movement may be unsure of the true metaphysical basis of things or might disagree with others about it, but there are I contend some core virtues which we can identify cropping up across time and space around which we can form a sketch of or a working articulation of our values which can then be later expanded upon if necessary, always with a questioning eye as to whether these virtues are beneficial (although in general these old values and wisdom are not maladaptive in any respect). There is a lot of good stuff about virtue from the Classical Greek and Roman world and even some from places like China (though aspects of the latter might be slightly askew or strange to Western eyes), not to mention the very extensive and serious work on virtue done by Christians which formed the basis of Western ethics for a very long time.
Etymology and philology are certainly needed in this context and you are correct that Latin is very important and indeed I think we should be working towards something of a Renaissance in regard to Latin usage and engagement. Among the other advantages Latin gives and the vast wealth of literature (from a vast sweep of history) it opens up, maintenance of Latin can also act as a bridge for future people to access our rich past whatever becomes of our current civilization. This is why I think the widespread of abandonment of Latin particulary by the Catholic Church is so potentially catastrophic (although there are some traditionalists who keep it up). Yes group study of the language would be a potentially fruitful endeavor and would provide a barrier between the more- and the less-dedicated tiers of our organization. I have a Latin/English Roman Catholic Missal from which I sometimes try to tease out what the words mean and I have learned a little but it is clear to me that without good knowledge of grammar, communication in Latin for modern English speakers would be practically impossible very difficult, so grammar study would be necessary. Might I also suggest a bit of Greek in addition? I get the impression of it being a lot easier than Latin.
Edit: Greek could be very useful too but probably even more difficult and certainly more abstruse to the majority of people, although speakers of Modern Greek could certainly attempt to decipher the Ancient and Koine Greek with varying degrees of success so perhaps it would be more permeable to prying eyes in this respect than Latin which is a dead language with no native speakers.
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Post by Ken (INTJ) on Aug 28, 2018 2:38:28 GMT
Diversity of method in this case is a good thing Agreed, I think having multiple games with multiple rule sets could be advantageous. The issue is finding the simplest possible rule set and then expanding outward in a volatile manner from that stable core. Also the idea of a rightist IB program is a good one.
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RJ
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Post by RJ on Aug 28, 2018 3:36:48 GMT
If a sufficient number of us (the most dedicated) gained fluency in Latin and conducted some of the higher level discourse in it, that would also provide a very natural barrier between the deep initiates and exoteric members. Why not skip the noise and go with Greek?
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Post by Napoleoff (INTP) on Aug 28, 2018 8:52:13 GMT
Diversity of method in this case is a good thing Agreed, I think having multiple games with multiple rule sets could be advantageous. The issue is finding the simplest possible rule set and then expanding outward in a volatile manner from that stable core. Also the idea of a rightist IB program is a good one. It will be better to if we can do what you say, finding the simplest possible rule set and expanding outward from that rather that starting off needlessly complex. But you're right, it is an issue because those simple rules need to be sound and if they're not sound they could have undesirable ramifications for the whole structure at a later date.
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Post by Napoleoff (INTP) on Aug 28, 2018 9:04:55 GMT
If a sufficient number of us (the most dedicated) gained fluency in Latin and conducted some of the higher level discourse in it, that would also provide a very natural barrier between the deep initiates and exoteric members. Why not skip the noise and go with Greek? As I mentioned above, Greek could be a good idea too. Perhaps a bit of both would be in order. Although I take back what I said about Greek maybe being a lot easier than Latin; a lot of people on the internet seem to think it's harder.
Edit: The fact that a version of Greek is still a living native language today might make Greek somewhat more permeable to prying eyes than Latin which has no native speakers today.
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RJ
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Post by RJ on Aug 28, 2018 14:13:15 GMT
Why not skip the noise and go with Greek? As I mentioned above, Greek could be a good idea too. Perhaps a bit of both would be in order. Although I take back what I said about Greek maybe being a lot easier than Latin; a lot of people on the internet seem to think it's harder.
Edit: The fact that a version of Greek is still a living native language today might make Greek somewhat more permeable to prying eyes than Latin which has no native speakers today.
I guess it really comes down to whichever texts will be the focal point that the group is ordered around (this seems like an important thing to decide). The spiritual substance of the west is in Greek so there's no avoiding the connection with a living language. Latin would only make sense if your intentions were to inhabit the Roman Catholic Church, the validity of that plan is questionable. Or if the authoritative texts are going to be the Vedas why not go with (the surely insulated from prying eyes) Sanskrit?
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Post by Napoleoff (INTP) on Aug 28, 2018 15:40:43 GMT
As I mentioned above, Greek could be a good idea too. Perhaps a bit of both would be in order. Although I take back what I said about Greek maybe being a lot easier than Latin; a lot of people on the internet seem to think it's harder.
Edit: The fact that a version of Greek is still a living native language today might make Greek somewhat more permeable to prying eyes than Latin which has no native speakers today.
I guess it really comes down to whichever texts will be the focal point that the group is ordered around (this seems like an important thing to decide). The spiritual substance of the west is in Greek so there's no avoiding the connection with a living language. Latin would only make sense if your intentions were to inhabit the Roman Catholic Church, the validity of that plan is questionable. Or if the authoritative texts are going to be the Vedas why not go with (the surely insulated from prying eyes) Sanskrit?
There are some people who say that Sanskrit isn't even a real language for learning or speaking, and that it was never a native language at all but is more of a code. In any case, it is apparently so hard that it would be more of an impediment to communication between the deep initiates than a barrier to the exoteric members of the organization. Plus such a difficult code as Sanskrit would make internet group study so cumbersome as to effectively rule it out. Scroll down on the following page; the Sanskrit section is not far from the top and explains some of what Sanskrit entails:
I would say Latin or Greek would be a better option right now, but I certainly would not rule out some of our very dedicated or a super-elite of our people learning Sanskrit in the fullness of time. We also have to be discerning about this and to not be charmed by certain things just because they are exotic; Sanskrit is certainly exotic, but looking at the state of Indian society versus traditional European society, perhaps the real wisdom for us is closer to home. However, for reading the Vedas or whatever Sanskrit would be a good area of specialist study.
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Post by borges on Aug 28, 2018 21:15:26 GMT
If a sufficient number of us (the most dedicated) gained fluency in Latin and conducted some of the higher level discourse in it, that would also provide a very natural barrier between the deep initiates and exoteric members. Why not skip the noise and go with Greek? Normal brain: English Expanded brain: Latin Enlightened brain: Greek Universal brain: Reconstructing Proto-Indo-European
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Post by vennyflennard (ENTP-A) on Aug 29, 2018 13:50:16 GMT
I think even lower level inclusion of Latin could afford us advantages in the long run as a joining incentive, capital creator and class signifier First of all learning Latin can be seen as a decisive moral act, in that the act of doing so would instill the ideal or at least the logical argument into our membership that the past, these cultures have value, and that it is good to protect them. This would be reinforced every time one engaged with the language academically or used in the wider sphere of life. Secondly an academy which allowed young intellectually minded people to engage in the classics as they were written would be be a pull for the right kind of people and serve not only recruitment but also vetting, and a potential for gaining funds. Latin used to be taught in the schools of my country and although people in my parents generation often tell they hated learning Latin school, I always personally resented never getting the chance myself. Religious services and music faithfully reproduced in Latin probably also has a degree of public appeal. Latin and other language based education services could act as one of many public filters that could be useful as buffers/roads to flow into the general hierarchy of the org.
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Post by flimp (INTJ) on Aug 29, 2018 16:33:32 GMT
I learned Latin in high school and it is a very difficult language to learn. Perhaps the energy devoted to learning Latin may not be worth the reward you gain. Why would you want to have Latin as a buffer between the lower people in the hierarchy and the people in the hierarchy? If its because of esoteric-ism for the sake of being esoteric, then this is a bad idea. Lastly I do have a suspicion that hierarchies that are too opaque reduce the willingness of those at the lower portions of the hierarchy to participate in the process. An example would be democracy in america where people have no idea who is in power and for what reasons. The masses often think (rightly so) that those in charge have one face for the public and one face for the corporate donors. This reduces peoples willingness to participate which is why so few people actually vote.
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Post by slotahimself (INTP) on Aug 29, 2018 17:49:19 GMT
You mentioned to slota that you were also shocked at how effortlessly this uprooting of traditional concepts has been carried out, and this is just one in a long series of data points that leads me to suspect a very deep rooted, ancient conspiracy at work behind the globalist power structures. Bringing language and education back into accord with our interests should be conjoined with a thorough account of how they were corrupted in the first place. On the critical side would involve study of conspiratorial history (of the well sourced scholarly variety) and study of globalist and postmodern texts. On the positive side we may want to look into philology and etymology as key areas to speciate into. It would be a large responsibility, but seeing how critical Latin is to understanding the grounding of our language we might want to consider some group study of the language. If a sufficient number of us (the most dedicated) gained fluency in Latin and conducted some of the higher level discourse in it, that would also provide a very natural barrier between the deep initiates and exoteric members.
See this is the key thing to me here and unfortunately I'm completely scatter brained due to coming to several different conclusions, refuting some, accepting them again and so on due to to even a minor insert of information into the question can, while not completely, largely shatter what I've garnered in the past in regards to these points. The internet is so over saturated with occult and esoteric analysis of history and religion that its spawned into this cartoon narrative with a new age mystique, then from that generates its own noise that drowns out and obfuscates anything remotely constructive or truthful when these are probably (in my estimation) some of the most important things to try to understand.
I'd be interested in being proven wrong here but I think the first thing that should be attempted for anyone going down this route in the future is a complete refutation of any occult guru, no matter what their prestige or positive accountability they seemingly have. Since most people that are remotely savvy to any of this have a lot of their view shaped by these people (who are often frauds, someone like Jordan Maxwell comes to mind), an extensive look at source material in a deconstructive capacity might be best. What has me in a total mental paralysis might sound nihilistic and postmodern, but how do you even identify what's "real" in this pursuit? Reading Kabbalah? What's that derivative of? Or anything like that. You could get lost for eternity in the Secret Teachings of All Ages and still have to face the fact that it's written by someone who has already contextualized a lot of those things, based on people that contextualized those things, and so on. We can't resurrect the high priests of 4000 years ago, nor the occultists of a few centuries. My biggest fear is either:
A. The key texts are unavailable to the public, as suggested that they're perhaps kept in libraries that we'll never have access to. B. Are destroyed C., and my worst fear, that these texts are merely ancillary to the actual forces at hand and all they amount to are pieces of what's already a vague operation that we're trying to make a total systematical analysis of based off only the texts available. It'd be like trying to reconstruct a language where half the letters aren't in documented existence. A code with no cipher that's being decoded by force, generating a newly-synthesized fraud.
I think the best we can do, and the best suggestion I've read in a long time anywhere that Napoleoff suggested is that there might not be any strict continuity or grand mystical conspiracy to this, which I'm sure a lot of people already accept. What's interesting is the suggestion that there may be something in that vein and with continuity that we're subjected to over the last few centuries. This should be a future pursuit. The ultimate fruits of which, if we were able to get anything academically substantial out of, would be that maybe we could put a bullet in the YouTube conspiracy bullshit and beat down a new and more coherent path for people trying to unpack this mystery that aren't in it just to be spooked by Freemasonic myths and Ancient Aliens-tier poison.
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